Tattoo Artist Magazine - The Quarterly Trade Journal for the Professional Tattooer

adrian lee
Salary Man
Interview by Crash

There exists very few masters of any art form and they come along quite seldom in life. The last 12 years or so have seen the greatest advancements in centuries in regard to tattoo art and during that time there have risen many blessed and talented artists, but you can count on your hands the individuals who are going to go down in history as the most influential of each era. I really think Adrian Lee to be one of those people. Maybe not for what he's done so far, though what he has done is damn impressive, but more for what I think he's going to do. I've often said this to people, "In 10 years Adrian Lee is going to be the most sought after tattooer around", and I honestly believe that to be true. I know Adrian and he's never happy with where he is; I can't picture him ever just sitting back and getting by when it comes to his art. He drives himself to excel in whatever it is he attempts, be it graffiti, tattooing, figure studies, or anti-propaganda propaganda- whatever it is, Adrian goes all out. It's part of who he is and it's the defining factor, I think, of NewSkool's success.

Crash: Let's start with the Suits Made to Fit show you guys put on last year. How did you find the experience?

adrian lee: It was really good. We learned a lot during that whole process ... and we're going to do more projects like that in the future.

Well that show created a whole lot of buzz in the tattoo community and I think a lot of people were blown away by what you accomplished. The skill you showed in putting it all together; the collection of artists who got involved, the package you created to present it all in ... everything was very impressive. I just wish I could have made it to the show. Back to the book ... you took quite a risk, (at least at the time it seemed like a risk), printing the book which documents the show. You financed that yourself, right? Went into debt and everything?

Deep into debt. It was risky at the time; we had no idea it was going to be so successful.

You've sold out of those by now, right?

Yeah. We sold out within about six months or so. I still have a few copies, but they are basically sold out. We're doing a Deluxe Edition of the book right now. This one will be much nicer; it'll have both books, [the NS guys & the Annex artists], in one hard cover volume. We designed a new cover. There will be new stickers and a DVD this time instead of the CD that was included with the first edition.

When and where will it be available?

It's at the printers now. So just check our web site, Lucky's or Pulse for updates on that.

What's the next project you guys are working on?

Well, we have another NS project in the planning stages, but we are each doing our own art projects right now. After completing the Suits Made to Fit venture, we dispersed creatively. You can't keep everyone funneled on that level indefinitely and remain sane. We will probably start another NS group project next year after we've had time to finish up what we're working on now.

What are you working on now?

Well, everyone is doing there own thing there own way. Myself, right now I'm working on a 50-piece project, 50 painted panels that connect together to make one piece.

Are you going to show it when you're finished?

Yes. Locally, it will show at the A.M. Gallery, in September. Then at the Sumusi Gallery in Osaka, Japan, in November.

How many panels do you have completed?

I don't know I try not to think about it too much. I just do them and move on. I don't even look at them much once they're completed. I just move on in order to keep the stream of consciousness going. But I'd say ... about 20-something so far. Stop it; you're making me realize how far behind I am!

What's the basis behind the whole project? How did it all come about?

Hmmmm. The idea is basically to explore the, uhhh ... well, it's a stream of consciousness, a compilation of the toxicity that bombards us everyday, all day. I'm trying highlighting the obvious that is subverted by corporate, media & governmental (same thing) interests, a visual display of their links. Looking for perspective amidst the barrage of information and therein creating a visual panorama. You know, taking all the puzzle pieces and trying to put them together. All the multitude of information that rushes through our minds tripping wires of paranoia, angst, and such, has to form something. But we never get to see it with clarity because it's subverted by these weapons of mass distraction all around us. You've seen my old sketchbooks ... there is a definite evolution of the character drawings over time.

You've had the "Salary Man" thing for a while now ... and I really can see the beginnings of this stuff all the way back with your artwork. How did it start?

Some girl in Japan actually named the "Salary Man". I was painting one on this electrical pole in Osaka and this girl walking by stopped and said "Ah! Sugoi! Sarery man!" It really surprised me cause' it hit it right on the mark and that's a common term in Japan. They often refer to people who work for giant pyramids as salary men. Before that I was just painting these decrepit business men whose lives had turned into a Talking Heads song. But hearing her say that really simplified it.

But as to how the idea came about for this project? If you think about it things like this brew for years. But for most people it fades because they become complacent. I mean, you put 500 TV channels in front of someone and there mind is fucking fried; goodbye free thought, hello sheep. Visually I have always drawn subversive imagery, but now it is approaching a kind of critical mass in my mind. It's a lot like the way we approached the body suit project. We felt like we had acquired enough of a visual library to attempt it so we did. So here I am now trying to get it all out. I just need to work it all out of my system. It's something that I've been working towards for years, just playing around with, and, hopefully, when it's done I'll be finished with it for a while ... having worked through it all during the course of the project.

What are you reading, what type of research are you doing?

I read every night so I can have some information to work with the next day. Let's see ... Noam Chomsky, Gary Webb, Howard Zin, Naimo Klien, William Cooper. You know, all the respected nuts. National Public Radio usually offers a balanced approach towards news reporting. I don't watch TV any more, no good information there. You can also go online and get articles form foreign papers to get a different perspective.

Do you HAVE to do this project? Do you feel compelled? I ask because whenever I read anything like that I end up really militant about it for a while and I just want to shake everyone I know to get them to wake up ... y'know?

I have to.

OK, back to the point now; what are you doing the individual paintings in? Oil, acrylic?

Enamels, latex, ink, some acrylic, mostly mixed media. Whatever I have on hand at the moment that feels like it'll work.

And for the show it's gonna' be, what, a room you walk into and all 50 pieces will be hanging together all the way around the room ... or something like that, right?

Yeah. There is no real end to the panels; they just start over again. The last painting will also be the first ... if I can figure out how to hang them all in sequence like that.

But the project definitely has different segments in it, right ... different sections?

There are several different movements ... I think there will be around five. And those each transition into the next stage.

So you're documenting the whole process: painting, postering, stickering, all of it ... and the plan is what? Are the individual panels going to be for sale once the show is over?

Each panel will be for sale and each painting will come with an accordion style book that you can pull out and view the whole thing at once, a DVD documenting much of the painting process and the hanging of propaganda the posters and stickers. I'll also include pages from my sketchbooks and a lot of still photos of other aspects of what I'm doing.

What kind of packaging is this going to have?

Probably a hand made cover on the book. The DVD will have lots of footage of me hanging the propaganda posters and stickers. It's not just the finished painted product I'm interested in; it's the whole process that counts. Which is true of most art, right? Once the piece is done its over, past tense. The process is what counts most often and then the reaction.

With all this stuff going on right now, how much tattooing are you doing?

Not a whole lot right now. I'm not taking on any more really big projects until I'm finished with this thing. I am still tattooing about three days a week, on a few new projects or finishing larger scale work in progress, but I just can't stay in this mindset unless I focus on it almost all the time to try to get it finished. That makes it difficult to get into any other project that requires a lot of my time and attention. It's hard to pull away and get focused on drawing a tattoo when my mind is flooded with MK-Ultra or some other consuming thought. But at the same time it feels good to get away from that and do tattooing. Which is part of the reason I am tattooing noticeable less. I can still take the time to focus 100% on fewer tattoos, as opposed to trying to tattoo on the same scale and not giving my clients all my energy, and still have time to put 100% into the existing project. It keeps me from going completely crazy too. I make enough income to cover the rent and plenty of food, so I'm good for now. As long as my coworkers don't threaten to excommunicate me for not tattooing enough, I'll be able to keep it up.

But after the show's are over, then you're back to tattooing full time again?

That's what I love to do.

Since we're on the tattoo aspects, let's talk about your tattooing and how it's advanced in the last few years. What do you think has been most significant since the body suit show?

Well, doing those studies gave me a better idea of what direction I need to be going in, and helped me to understand shapes and flow a lot more.

You seem to definitely be working on larger scale pieces. I don't know how many huge pieces you were doing prior to the body suit show but it seems that now you have an abundance of large projects in the works. Are you doing a lot more work since the body suit show?

Yeah, up until I started painting again. Now I have an abundance of large projects in limbo. I let a few creep into my life as time allows but until January it'll be tight.

What's interesting about the big projects you're working on is that not very much of it looks like what you did for the show. You know what I mean?

It's progressed, and that was the real purpose of the project anyway. We figured if we wanted to do that type of work we had better study it on paper and canvas before we attempted it on skin. I don't really even like most of the ones I did for the show. If I could redo it, I'd loose all but maybe two of them now.

Another aspect I've noticed, and I don't know how much of this you were doing 2 years ago, but I see that you've been doing a lot of photo references for your tattoos, building your designs around real models.

I've always done that.

Really? I never really realized it before. Maybe I just didn't see that many of your figure tattoos.

I'm doing more figure stuff now than ever before. And I'm using a lot more reference photos too, stuff that I shoot myself to work from.

Will you walk us through your whole process for a good sized figure tattoo?

It starts with the consultation. When we first start talking about an idea I'll scribble around in a notebook, just putting down some ideas. Then when the persons appointment approaches I'll start running it around in my head. I'll devote a few pages to the sketchbook. Sometimes it magically appears but more often than not it takes a few blows to the skull to get it out onto paper. I don't know why it takes so long sometimes, I should just be able to go right into it, but eventually I work up some concept sketches. Once get the form I am looking for I can start working on a line drawing. If need be though I'll shoot some reference photos in similar poses to my sketch. So I'll call Tyson, or Ron, or whoever is willing to get mostly naked for me and well shoot some flicks.

Once you have that part done, you'll do, what, a tonal study and then a color study?

Almost everything gets a quick, rough tone study. I find that it's important to do that because with what I do, with any large scale tattooing really, the shapes are just as important as the outline. If I still don't feel completely competent with the direction then I'll do a color study. Most of the time I don't work it all the way to completion, I like the freedom to be spontaneous somewhat while I'm tattooing.

Yeah, I have a bad habit of doing that sometimes. I try to work everything out in advance, and then the whole tattooing process gets sort of stale.

Well, if you're unsure, you should work it out before hand. But if you already know basically what you're going to do, if you can visualize the process then go with it. It's more enjoyable for you and it allows you to wok with the body more instead of copying what's on paper. It's easy to kill the original idea if it's completed before you start. Then essentially all you are doing is copying it and a lot of times you loose the life. But it is a matter of confidence too. You have to be able to project to your client that you are in control and if you are stopping constantly second-guessing your self then the tattooee gets uncomfortable. I work on the concept until I am ready to tattoo it. Weather it be, drawing it to completion or sketching a few shapes on the skin, whatever the situation calls for.

How many hours goes into a typical figure tattoo you do, say, half-sleeve size?

It really depends what you're tattooing, but I'd say 5 to 12 hours. As long as it takes.

Is that the type of imagery you want to do full time? What is it that attracts you to any certain piece ... besides money, that is. (Laughter)

The concept and the form are what excite me. I like to keep the idea simple and let it expand from there as opposed to coming at someone with a litany of ideas I prefer to start with a few and let them develop. Say if you come at me and say "I want this and and this and this to go with that next to this part symbolizing my father and these in the background and fire and water and I like tribal tear outs too!" I'd throw everything out and start with symbolizing your father.

And from there? (meaning... do you then try to incorporate some of those other elements the client wants, or do you push them in other directions or what...??)

Well, from there we can build on the heart of the matter. I don't want to steal their concept I just want to make it coherent. That's part of the fun, the mixture of ideas, back and forth. Usually the client is trying to fill space so they come up with all these ideas for you. So, more often then not we don't need all the extra baggage and we can keep the image simple and build off it from there. But sometimes some elements are important to them for various reasons so you have to figure out how to get those in there. If you can figure out a more subtle way to symbolize the image it will say so much more. But yeah, I do often encourage them to go this way or that way and yeah it's partly for my gain too, but as long as they realize you are only trying to give them the best you can they open up to your ideas too. But no tribal tear outs under any circumstance!

What do you think are your strongest assets in regard to your tattoo work? And what do you think are your greatest weaknesses?

Right now in life my strongest asset is NewSkool. My greatest weakness is and always will be time.

Where do you want to be in 3 years? 5 years? etc...

I don't set specific goals for myself until I'm set on a definite direction. So now my main focus is getting these paintings done. From there I like to keep the vision of the future open, just let it evolve, let all the different directions funnel. But without a doubt we'll all be dead a lot longer than we're alive. So in that respect, I intend to accomplish as much as possible before then.

What part of your tattooing frustrates you? (Obviously, I think your color theory and figure studies are your primary strength ... what about the other side?)

See your asking me this one again. There isn't much that doesn't frustrate me about my tattooing. Feel free to point out a weakness and I'll show four more. I guess I struggle most with the concept and then again with the final creation of strong forms, pre dermal execution. I have a long way to go when it comes to working with figure execution and color balance. But other than that, I don't think it is appropriate to publicly and overtly voice your internal weaknesses when you are a tattooer. People come to you because they trust you. Just because I am apathetic and accomplishments are sooo fleeting and I question what the fuck I'm doing to these people everyday, doesn't grant me the right to tell someone their tattoo is not up to par. I want someone who has a tattoo to feel confident in it and me saying to them your tattoo sucks, that's crap and I'll never tattoo like that again. That's inappropriate. Compare it to a surgeon publicly saying I don't do that procedure any longer because I haven't ever been happy with the work. But, colleague-to-colleague, we can discuss and criticize openly and that's where it is most productive.

Talk about the concept of NS?

NS is an evolving concept.

What is "The Collective"?

You've seen Voltron.

How has your vision of the studio evolved?

Paco and I set up the studio so we could work without a moneyman constricting what we could tattoo. It was relatively simple, split the bills, and use the remaining time to be creative. On the outset it was so exhilarating because for the first time we were tattooing what we had been trying to, all with out someone breathing down our necks for the skrilla. Over time, more and more people became involved and for a while it was really chaotic trying to manage the thing. Really, the energy is the only thing that it kept in going. Eventually it got to be too much like trying to run a "tattoo shop". Not that there is anything at all wrong with that formula, it just wasn't working with what were doing. We wanted to be tattooers and we were becoming the moneymen. We're not businessmen and it was seriously straining the relationship between Paco and me. On top of that it was creating an "us and them" aspect between us and those we worked with. So, out of necessity, we took a more democratic approach. We borrowed from the format that Marcus had used for Primal Urge and applied part of it to NS. We gave up much of our authority and those who worked with us took on more of the responsibility. It puts everyone on a more even plane and allows us to work together better creatively. It's the flow of energy that is important for us. We do what we need to to keep that going. Without it there is no point.

What do you look for when bringing in someone new to NS?

We look for drive, dedication, what they are going to bring to the group. If you're an astonishing tattooer but are only out for yourself then this isn't the place for you. Basically we look for someone with a fast walk, a good heart and a steady hand.

What's next for NewSkool Tattoo?

Tomorrow we're gonna' do some tats.